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I tested two conditions of S110V, one austenitized at 2050 and another at 2150°F, with both tempered at 500°F. The standard blade steel of the Native 5 is CPM S30V stainless steel, but Spyderco has expanded that offering with additions like super high-grade CPM-S110V and Maxamet steels. The test produces a number for each steel of rope cuts made, so steels can be placed in a hierarchy where the interested person can get a decent idea of where one steel might sit against another. However, niobium is a “stronger” carbide former than vanadium, meaning it can form niobium carbide even in the presence of high amounts of chromium. The test produces a number for each steel of rope cuts made, so steels can be placed in a hierarchy where the interested person can get a decent idea of where one steel might sit against another. If they found a small amount of ferrite in S110V that would have contributed to the decision to increase Co, of course. That aside, the Manix is … There is hardenable stainless steels with just 0.03% carbon . Und das ist definitiv falsch. but the hardness is limited to only ~ 35 HRc . The primary difference is out-of-this-world edge retention at the cost of a minimal reduction in toughness. $305.00. Perhaps they identified high Mo as an issue as well, such as difficulty in annealing or excessive hardenability leading to cracking during cooling after forging. Spyderco Native 5 Lightweight Dunkelblau Klappmesser Taschenmesser C41PDBL5 CPM-S110V 4,4 von 5 ... vs the Sage 5, but not enough to stick with the lock back. A smaller amount of harder carbides (like vanadium carbide) gives a better combination of toughness and wear resistance. most of these carbides are of M6C type while only 1.7% by volume is vandium carbides . Combined, these features offer a distinctive look and exceptional edge geometry. If you are unfamiliar with the Para Military 2, this will help you get a better understanding of one of the most popular knife designs in the past 10 years. $265.00. Elmax. Both of these steels are a real bear to sharpen up! I don’t know of any other powder metallurgy steels that even have as much as the 3% in the current version of S110V. https://www.patreon.com/Knifesteelnerds, Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window). And if the formation temperature is too high, carbides will form in the melt before the steel can be gas atomized to form the powder. $236.00. Spyderco Para Military 2 Knife. Even with that handicap, it’s a great knife. If you find trouble understanding the meaning of hardness or HRC, here you can find a blog post explaining it. Although Maxamet isn't stainless, but at the same time Maxamet is tougher compared to Crucible CPM S110V steel, which can result in better edge holding ability, and cutting performance with the right geometry and heat treatment. I have a spreadsheet of all of the heat treatments I have done in the past along with ThermoCalc estimates of elements in solution. I didn’t mention clogging of the nozzle in this article as that is not the only issue. S110V's data sheet mentions, for example, that it has better corrosion resistance than S90V. I have 3 spyderco Native 5’s in S110V, S90V and in Maxamet. is there is a heat treatable knife steel have a corrosion resistance equal to 316 or even 304 steels ? Regardless, the edge retention of the steel is high and perhaps worrying about whether or not it is as good as S90V isn’t of practical use. And niobium carbide contains very little chromium. Para™ 3 G-10 Black/Black Blade. Although Maxamet isn't stainless, but at the same time Maxamet is tougher compared to Crucible CPM S110V steel, which can result in better edge holding ability, and cutting performance with the right geometry and heat treatment. According to the chemical composition and the HRC of the Maxamet steel, it offers the following features: Edge Retention: With a hardness above 65HRC, due to the high amount of Tungsten, Vanadium, and Carbon, the Maxamet steel knife has the best edge retention. The primary difference is out-of-this-world edge retention at the cost of a minimal reduction in toughness. Or very high toughness with AEB-L or 14C28N. The blade features a full-flat grind, a distal taper, and an understated wedge. You can see that S90V and S110V are along a similar trendline (only the 2150 condition of S110V is shown). $230.00 . One change to S110V was a reduction in Nb from 3.5% to 3%. I prefer the S35vn blah on the LW scales. Manufacturing Technology - MM. With S110 you have to battle burrs just like S30. Cru-Wear Furthermore, there is some chromium present in vanadium carbide, further reducing corrosion resistance. TWISTED SISAL MERCH - THANKS TO MISHEARDKNIFEREVIEWS: https://teespring.com/twisted-sisal-merch Remember to subscribe for more lunacy - hit the bell etc! Matching 316 corrosion resistance while also reaching 60+ Rc would be very difficult even with cobalt. The knife looks in fine condition all over with an even grind on both sides of the blade. Each knife comes without scales or … With S110V having quite a bit of each of those elements the steel cannot be fully hardened when it has no cobalt in it. The same knives in S110V are listed about 30% cheaper than the Maxamet knives of the same model. As a rule, the harder the steel, the easier it breaks, so the Maxamet steel is very hard steel that can break very fast, but it’s tough enough to handle some beating, damaging work. Spyderco Native 5 Lightweight Dunkelblau Klappmesser Taschenmesser C41PDBL5 CPM-S110V 4,4 von 5 ... vs the Sage 5, but not enough to stick with the lock back. Machinability: Maxamet steel is a great steel for machinability thanks to Sulfur(If you’re interested in Maxamet for a machine, the company offers an improved “Sulfur” Maxamet for machinability with 0.23% of sulfur). FYI the maxamet manix is a lightweight without liners and is pinned. It's cool to carry a knife made from Maxamet, M390, or CPM-S110V. S110V has very high edge retention, as expected, being similar to CPM-10V. Pacific Salt™ 2. What is its hardness? The Spyderco Para Military 2 - What more needs to be said? Native® FRN Grey Maxamet. I'm still curious to see a custom knife made out of Maxamet though. If you are unfamiliar with the Para Military 2, this will help you get a better understanding of one of the most popular knife designs in the past 10 years. S110V Steel is more balance compared to the Maxemet, as you can see, Maxamet offers extreme edge retention in the cost of other criteria. I'm still curious to see a custom knife made out of Maxamet though. Maxamet’s distinguishing metallurgical characteristic is the high carbon content (2.15%) and the inclusion of 10% Tungsten. Buy Spyderco Native 5 Signature Folder Knife with 2.95" CPM S30V Black Steel Blade and Black FRN Handle - CombinationEdge - C41PSBBK5: Pocket Knives & Folding Knives - Amazon.com FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases However, the patent for S110V specifically calls out 154CM as a basis of design with its 14Cr-4Mo, providing good corrosion resistance with less Cr, and that can be seen in the initial version of S110V with 14Cr-3.5Mo. Native® 5 FRN Pink. Die Zähigkeit ist angemessen hoch, jedoch auf Kosten der Korrosionsbeständigkeit (nicht rostfrei). Instead, the inventors of S110V used cobalt, which is an austenite stabilizer at high temperatures but does not increase retained austenite when quenching to martensite, unlike Ni and Mn. $255.00. If the carbides form in the liquid they are much larger then if they form during solidification of the powder. This would likely make the new version marginally worse in terms of toughness-wear resistance balance, as the original version had a higher proportion of NbC and VC and slightly less overall carbide. This was not necessarily a new discovery; it was long known in austenitic stainless steels that high Mo improved “pitting resistance,” and steels intended for seawater applications typically need high Mo. P'Kal™ G-10 Black. I won’t buy S110 anymore even though I admit it is good on paper. In heat treatments of S30V, S35VN, S45VN, and SPY27, an increase in austenitizing temperature was found to increase both hardness and toughness, so this result would be consistent with that. WTS--Spyderco Mule blades (MAXAMET, K390, S110V, CTS-XHP and Cobalt Special) Prices reduced . Manufacturing Technology - MM. Niobium, like vanadium, forms very hard carbides that contribute greatly to wear resistance. $200.00. However, a version of S125V with 2.7% Mo was in the S90V patent, which predated S30V, so it isn’t 100% clear in which direction inspiration occurred. So if you intend to use in humid environment, you better take care of your knife, other than that it’s a great steel of an EDC knife. $250.00. Pacific Salt™ 2 Black Blade. I have the Maxamet LW version, the pink S30v, the Satin blade natural G10 with M4, and the original (discontinued) G10 with liners and S35vn. Where a steel like S30V really shines is in sharpening. If you’re looking for an EDC knife with a Maxamet Steel, the  NATIVE 5 is your choice. I tested S45VN in my 1% saltwater spray corrosion test. This is exactly why I don’t evaluate production knives to compare steels. Although Maxamet isn't stainless, but at the same time Maxamet is tougher compared to Crucible CPM S110V steel, which can result in better edge holding ability, and cutting performance with the right geometry and heat treatment. $160.00. My edge testing shows how various steels retain absolute sharpness at the fine cutting edge vs man made materials, in this case, fibrous rope. Es hatte geheißen, daß Armhaare nicht denkbar seien. So the amount of Ni and Mn needs to be kept to relatively low levels so that a good combination of hardness and corrosion resistance can be obtained. The Maxamet steel in considered as a “Super Steel”, So it’s a High-end Alloy steel, with an uncommon chemical composition, but I can say that the closest one to it is the CPM S110V(even if it’s stainless steel), in exception of wear resistance; the Maxamet is a great match for the S110v in edge retention, hardness, wear-resistance and price range which is between 100-200 Usd. However, this steel has high hardness and corrosion resistance which can mean excess retained austenite which sometimes leads to inflated toughness values. I will use “0888” and “0888MAX” interchangeably throughout this article except for when specifically discussing the steel below. $145.00. As you can notice, it has only 4.75% of Chromium, which means its not stainless steel, and it’s very high in Vanadium and Tungsten, which makes a tough alloy with excellent wear resistance. $160.00. The Mule Team was set up with identical knife blade blank designs in different steels in an attempt to compare apples to apples when testing the knives. The Griptilian is comfortable but it feels totally different in your hands versus the PM2. The reduction in Mo from the original version (3.5%) to the final version (2.25%) likely means that these values are no longer accurate. Understand that a keen edge requires a dimension of around 100nm (1/10 of a micron) and the vanadium-rich carbides in Maxamet, or S110V, or even the chromium carbides in ZDP189 are 1-2 microns in size. Von Gesichtsrasur war ja ausdrücklich nicht die Rede. this should be called “super steel” . For example, S90V edge retention is closer to M398 when at the same hardness. Its an extreme alloy with insane hardness and tremendous edge retention while still retaining a reasonable amount of toughness but at the expense of corrosion resistance (it’s not stainless). Eine extreme Legierung mit unglaublichen Härtewerten und einer atemberaubenden Schnitthaltigkeit. Es hatte geheißen, daß Armhaare nicht denkbar seien. Spyderco Paramilitary 2 vs Benchmade Griptilian : It’s no secret the Griptilian is one of my favorites but overall the PM2 is simply a better knife. CPM-S110V. So sharpening these knives to a keen edge with ceramic involves crushing those carbides (near the apex) into “nano-dust” and burnishing the matrix around them. If there is any steel in Crucible’s line up that is likely to inherent the mantle of “awesome all around performer” from S35VN (which, in turn, took it from S30V), it will be this steel (or one yet released). Thanks to Aaron @ Gough Custom, Aaron McVay, Mark Scott, Jeffrey St. Claire, Grant Seim III, and saiiiiiii1 for becoming Knife Steel Nerds Patreon supporters! The M390 offers better toughness, corrosion resistance and it’s a bit easier to sharpen compared to the Maxamet, but for the edge retention Maxamet is the best. The patent for S110V and the original datasheet released in September 2008 (I archived it here) is the original composition labeled as “patent” in the composition table. If the problem of adding Niobium is just clogging atomization why they didn’t just use larger nozzles ? I gotta ask what your hardness test results were. Through over a month of consistent use, my Paramilitary 2 blade was still sharp enough to slice through phone book paper and stick against my thumbnail. Corrosion Resistance: Corrosion resistance is always related to the amount of Chromium in the steel, the Maxamet has a low amount of (4% compared to 12-14% in the stainless steels), which makes not great steel for corrosion resistance. Below I have plotted the steel also in relation to other stainless steels along with a hardness-toughness trendline from S60V. In previous corrosion testing I performed, I found that the effect of Mo topped out at a certain level, but it would be surprising if Crucible also came to a similar conclusion. The results of these … It’s high-speed tool steel made by @CarpenterTechnology. S110V and S90V are my favorites in the very high edge retention stainless steel category, depending on the level of corrosion resistance that is necessary for the application. Both of these steels are a real bear to sharpen up! S90V offers somewhat better toughness and edge retention making it more balanced for applications that need only medium corrosion resistance. I didn’t know how realistic is Jmatpro but I’m sure that 0.5% carbon should secure 55-60 HRc hardess . Pacific Salt™ 2. S110V has a similar Mo content as well so it should still have better corrosion resistance than S45VN. Auch von einer Ruinierung der Schneide kann nicht die Rede sein. The Spyderco Para Military 2 - What more needs to be said? Para™ 3 G-10 Dark Gray Maxamet. In an attempt to clear out some of my unused knives, I’m putting up some of my Spyderco Mule Team blades. The cobalt content was increased from 2 to 2.5%, likely based on updated estimates of how much austenite stabilization is necessary after the changes to Nb, Cr, and Mo. electroslag, forged ring/ … Para Military™ 2 G-10 Digital Camo. ... S110V. As mentioned in the niobium section, there are limits to niobium alloying with typical powder metallurgy steel production. $310.00. I haven’t performed a full range of heat treatment experiments on S110V, but comparisons with S90V show the two heat treating relatively similarly. This will be relevant to the toughness discussion later on. Spyderco Paramilitary 2 vs Benchmade Griptilian : It’s no secret the Griptilian is one of my favorites but overall the PM2 is simply a better knife. Eine extreme Legierung mit unglaublichen Härtewerten und einer atemberaubenden Schnitthaltigkeit. It does offer the best sharpenability of the very high edge retention stainless steels because of less vanadium carbide, however, and it also has very good corrosion resistance. They have the same blade grinds, and they are heat treated and processed by the same manufacturer, of course. S110V and M390/20CV/204P do have higher Cr in solution than S45VN. The patent for the steel was first filed in 2006 by inventors Alojz Kajinic, Andrzej Wojcieszynski, and Maria Sawford, all of Crucible Steel. Or maybe they thought it gave a bit more “factor of safety” to ensure full austenitization would be possible. That method has its own issues such as many carbides clumping together, in general PM steels have a more uniform microstructure. I’m eventually going to stop plugging my book Knife Engineering in every new article, but that day is not today. I swap the parts around. Spyderco Para 3 - Partially Serrated . Enter your email address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. Where a steel like S30V really shines is in sharpening. Your email address will not be published. My guess is few heats of the original composition were ever produced, so experiments on that version are mostly academic at this point. The Mo content of M390 is lower, however, so it is difficult to predict how things balance out when comparing higher Cr vs higher Mo. why didn’t just replace the nickel in 316 steel for example by cobalt to make such steel “hardenable” ? Therefore, I see the main choice being between S110V and S90V for best very high edge retention stainless. However, more carbon means more carbides which reduces corrosion resistance and toughness, as described in this article. (This is not heat-related). But for simple slicing tasks, this knife will go on for a seriously long time. Wear Resistance: the wear resistance is excellent, due to the Tungsten, Vanadium, and Carbon, the Maxamet offers a great wear resistance. So forming austenite at high temperature is the first required step for the final heat treatment of a knife. The steel has good properties including high edge retention and corrosion resistance along with decent toughness. $145.00. Pacific Salt™ 2 Black Blade. You will also see I have two compositions listed for S110V, one labeled “patent” and one labeled “final.” The initial version of S110V was modified leading to the version that we have today. Model # SP-C81GPDGY2 . Para Military™ 2 G-10 Dark Gray Maxamet. In Stock . Native® 5 G-10 Black. Native® 5 Salt® $186.00. I swap the parts around. But the chromium increase was more than was necessary to achieve a similar amount of chromium in solution (see the table below), and they also decreased the Mo content by a similar amount to how much the Cr was increased (from 3.5 to 2.25%), so the reason for that change is not completely clear to me. So it could be that S110V has similar toughness to S90V, but also recall that the 2050 condition led to lower hardness with no improvement in toughness. This isn't a knife to beat on or put any lateral pressure on. What is its chemical composition? The s110v steel is noticeably sharper than my s30v blade is out of the boxes. Von Gesichtsrasur war ja ausdrücklich nicht die Rede. The results of these … I will discuss the differences after describing more about the general design of the steel. As mentioned in the article deburring is mostly an effect of retained austenite, and the recommended heat treatment for the steel isn’t necessarily the best for avoiding it. You can see that the carbon in solution is similar across the three grades, meaning each would achieve similar hardness. Spyderco ParaMilitary 2 Dark Gray G10 Stonewash Maxamet C81GPDGY2 . But S30 at least eventually gets sharp, S110 never does (for me). The 0888MAX has an overall length of 9.125″, a 3.75″ blade, a weight of 7.56 ounces, and is made in the USA. Making high corrosion resistance steels with high chromium in solution also leads to more retained austenite, as explained in this article on Vanax steel. an example is an old grade called vasco MA the matrix of M2 steel . Manufacturing Technology - MM. This is not scientific, bit here goes. all powder metallurgy fabricated by hot isostatic pressure which is sooo expensive , adding a ball milling step just add a little to the cost . In Crucible’s wear resistance testing of the original S110V, they show the following chart for wear resistance, that appears to show an improvement over S90V: However, if you plot those values versus hardness it becomes apparent that the two steels have the same wear resistance: So Crucible’s data shows that there was no improvement in wear resistance from S90V to S110V, which lines up relatively well with our edge retention testing. I do emphasize with the guy who chipped his blade, but I do find Maxamet to be less fragile than S110V. Metallurgy and Testing of Knives and Steel. Checkout Deals of the Day on Amazon, What is the hardness(HRC) of Maxamet steel, Best scout carry knife with horizontal Sheath. I did a large number of edge retention experiments which were summarized in this article, and I also added M398 which was discussed here. A similar comparison was made in the patent, as 11% V is roughly equivalent to the V-Nb combination in S110V. I have the Maxamet LW version, the pink S30v, the Satin blade natural G10 with M4, and the original (discontinued) G10 with liners and S35vn. Learn more in this article about carbides. P'Kal™ G-10 Black. So sharpening these knives to a keen edge with ceramic involves crushing those carbides (near the apex) into “nano-dust” and burnishing the matrix around them. That said, S30V is a great steel! That said, S30V is a great steel! But for simple slicing tasks, this knife will go on for a seriously long time. There are other elements that can stabilize austenite as well, notably carbon, nickel, and manganese, though those elements also increase retained austenite. These two factors mean that using niobium instead of vanadium can lead to a steel with high wear resistance from hard niobium carbides, while having high corrosion resistance because there is little interaction between chromium and niobium, leaving the chromium alone to contribute to corrosion resistance. However, Crucible’s testing was with the original S110V which, as I described before, would have a greater proportion of NbC and VC carbides for wear resistance. In Stock . Both are ridiculously difficult to sharpen. Spyderco Para Military 2 Knife. Your email address will not be published. Maxamet’s distinguishing metallurgical characteristic is the high carbon content (2.15%) and the inclusion of 10% Tungsten. That sounds low to me though I haven’t used JMatPro in the past to predict retained austenite. ... S110V. You’ll pay for it though, at roughly 1.5x the price. The high chromium affects the amount of vanadium carbide that is formed, and the high vanadium actually promotes the formation of chromium carbide, dropping corrosion resistance and toughness. As a side note, both the original and new version of the S110V datasheet shows the following for heat treatment/hardness data: However this primarily shows the hardness that results in the upper tempering range, where Mo has the biggest effect on hardness. Whether this was due to a problem that was observed in production or simply being cautious I am not sure. Maxamet. In fact the revised datasheet shows all of the same data for corrosion resistance, hardness, and wear resistance despite the fact that the change in composition was relatively substantial. The pocket clip, like all PM2 and Para3 clips is just terrible. (from my limited experience and the specific design goals for … I covered the history of them in more detail in a previous article. But I still don’t know for sure why S110V wasn’t as good as S90V in testing. My S110V CATRA knife has no issues with getting sharp or in deburring it. There was a somewhat surprising and little discussed composition change with S110V, for mostly unknown reasons (though probably related to manufacturing). Both are capable of very high levels of hardness. adding niobium carbide “if all regarding problems solved” to this steel can push hardness/edge retention to a very high numbers . S90V and S110V both offer superior carbide structure and toughness when compared with M398. I find the same edge retention results as Larrin, the S90V edge retention is better than the S110V. It’s was a belt for knives with a different chemical composition, it has a high volume of Tungsten and high in carbon which is revolutionary in the knife industry. Well, it’s largely still up for debate but from my experience Maxamet matches S110V in edge retention but falls short on corrosion resistance (it’s not stainless). One of the best knives you can get if you’re looking for high-quality steel and premium design, the NATIVE 5 is a beast that combines strength, superior cutting performance, edge retention, and point utility it comes with a grey, injection-moulded reinforced-fibreglass-nylon handle, the Native 5 has a back lock mechanism and a four-position pocket clip, which makes it very comfortable and efficient. If you’re worried about the steel (my experience seems to be an outlier), Spyderco also offers the Manix 2LW in CPM-S110V for around $35 more. Maxamet is the latest powder steel from Carpenter (aka CarTech). the results says that the retained austenite was only 7% . I have two Spydercos in S110 and a Benchmade in S90. Get Up To 95% Off Today! using 5% Ni instead gives Ms of about -66°C (-87°F) . However, an increase in both Cr and Mo means a significant improvement in corrosion resistance for S110V. The Mo content of M390 is lower, however, so it is difficult to predict how things balance out when comparing higher Cr vs higher Mo. Maxamet is a powder steel from Carpenter, an American steel company. If there is any steel in Crucible’s line up that is likely to inherent the mantle of “awesome all around performer” from S35VN (which, in turn, took it from S30V), it will be this steel (or one yet released). This makes sense because of the lower carbide content of S90V, while the smaller carbides of S110V provides better toughness than S125V despite the similar carbide content. So more heat treatments would have to be tested to see if greater toughness at lower hardness could be achieved. Maybe 0.4% if the effect of cobalt is linear to increase Ms. Also be careful that all of that is in solution at the austenitizing temperature you calculated for. Native® 5 FRN Dark Blue CPM S110V. The obvious answer is Yes, its prey good for knives, especially if you’re looking for a knife with excellent edge retention and very high wear resistance, Maxamet is a “Super steel” for your knife, but it’s not a stainless steel, it has only 4% of chromium in it, so it’s not so great concerning corrosion resistance. The matrix of high speed steels contains only between 0.4-0.6% C , so 0.5% C seems to be enough for reaching high hardness . And in the more recent comparison directly with M398, S110V again performed similarly. In older versions of ThermoCalc it showed that S110V with 2% Co would be fine, which Crucible would have been using at the time, but newer versions show a small amount of ferrite at 2150°F, around 4%. This choice comes down to how important corrosion resistance is to the application. According to Zknives, ZT had trouble grinding the Maxamet blades after heat treat, and experienced issues with warping if they ground the blades before heat treat.

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